![]() M: There are so many people who are involved in the human rights violations and the suppression, and, you know, they need to be dealt with. SIMON: That's the Islamic Republic's revolutionary guard. We can do the same thing leadership of IRGC. You can make it difficult for them to move around. ![]() That's only going to affect those in power. So one option is just sanctioning particular top Iran government officials. ![]() There are so many other options other than these to do. People make the mistake of reducing the foreign involvement to either sanctions against the people or a full-scale military intervention. The thing is, you have to define foreign involvement. I think foreign involvement can definitely help. What do you think other countries, other people around the world can do to support the movement? Or would foreign support harm the movement at this point? SIMON: The protests have attracted a lot of admiration around the world. The other thing is, I think there's a capacity for at least finding an intermittent government with some sort of approval from the people. The problem is they're either exiled or they are jailed. M: Of course, for a movement that has no head, that's somewhat troublesome, but I'm not too worried about it because we do have many potential leaders. If the Islamic Republic falls and you have this diverse, broad-based protest movement, who leads next? What happens to the country? SIMON: I wonder if you have any concerns about the problems of possible success. Almost everyone I know has developed some sort of mental health issue. The second part is I'm worried about their mental health. ![]() You worried about family and friends who are still there? What I miss is being involved in things, knowing what exactly is happening, 'cause the moment you step your foot outside the country, no matter how much conviction you have, you start to lose your grasp. Like, I still cannot sleep well because of what I've seen during them. M: I don't miss the protests because they were scary. Are you glad to be safe? Or do you miss the protest? SIMON: We note you're out of the country now. There are more important things to attack right now. Every time they've spoken out, people have said to them, now is not the time. SIMON: May I ask what your hope is for - reform or something more? Everything is chaotic right now, so it might easily skyrocket and go up. But at the same time, it's not a huge number - like, maybe it's 10% or something. And right now, I think the probability of this leading to regime change is more than it's ever been. M: So every revolution is just a protest for the moment that the regime topples. SIMON: Would you at this point call it a protest movement or a revolution? If the protests erupt, even if you're not a protester yourself, you may get entangled within it. M: There is definitely strong presence of military and police, so it's somewhat fearsome. I began by asking him what it was like in the streets of Tehran. While he has left Iran in recent days, he still has family there, and speaking to the press might put them in danger. And among those who has protested was a 25-year-old we'll identify only by his first initial, M. Thousands gathered at that cemetery in western Kurdistan, part of over 40 days of protests that have spread across the country. Iranians chanted, freedom, freedom, freedom, this week at the grave of Jina Amini, also known as Mahsa, who died while in the custody of the country's morality police.
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